BWIN scam

**AimingHigh** · 07-19-09, 04:41 AM

It's NOT a scam by BWin. You deposited funds from someone else's Moneybooker's account and got a bonus. I don't know ANY sportsbook that would not see that as bonus abuse.

Some books would respond by confiscating the bonus and winnings and refunding the initial deposit; others would also confiscate the initial deposit - not just BWin. Those terms are one of their only protections against bonus abusers. While it may seem overly harsh to someone with no intent to abuse, the book can't readily distinguish between those with and those without intent; all they can see is that someone deposited from someone else's Moneybooker's account.

I'm sorry it happened to you, but you really need to read the terms and conditions and use your common sense. Depositing from someone else's Moneybooker's account is only asking for trouble.

**AimingHigh** · 07-19-09, 04:53 AM

From looking at BWin's rules, I'd guess they actually fall into the category of refunding the initial deposit. I think there are 2 scenarios, but they have the same outcome:
(1) If your friend already has an account, then it looks like he's opening a 2nd with your details;
(2) If your friend doesn't already have an account, then it looks like it's you giving BWin false details.

If your friend already has an account at BWin, I think this situation would be covered here:

"Every user may hold only one account. Users already registered are not allowed to register as new users under another name or with another e-mail address. If a user violates this rule, the company is entitled to cancel any bets placed as well as to cancel any FreeBets booked into the respective account. Concerning FreeBet cards and FreeBet codes, each user may redeem only one FreeBet card or one FreeBet code per promotion." (Rule 4 under "Registration / Betting Account").

That rule seems to suggest that they will only cancel bets, so implicitly suggests that they will refund the initial deposit to your friend's Moneybooker's account. There may be another, more specific rule, but that was all I could find that looks like it covers this situation. If that rule governs, I would suggest you ask for the initial deposit to be refunded to his/her Moneybookers account.

If your friend doesn't already have his/her own account at BWin, then it would fall under this - and again, it looks like you should get the initial deposit back but no winnings:

"Participation in the company’s offer requires registration as a user. To register, the user has to fill out correctly and completely the relevant application form containing the following details: first name and surname; place of residence; e-mail address; date of birth; gender; choose a user ID; choose a password, choose a private question and answer (this question is asked before real money is paid out or if, for example, the player has forgotten his password and asks for a new password).
The company reserves the right to exclude users with false particulars from participating in the games offered and to refuse them the payment of any winnings. On the company’s request, the user is obliged to produce an official document showing his photo, proving his identity (a passport copy, driver's licence or identity card)." (Rules 1, 2 under "Registration / Betting Account")

**AimingHigh** · 07-19-09, 05:07 AM

Although I'm not sure how this rule interacts with 1, 2, and 4:

"In case of suspected manipulations or fraud, and in case of any violation of these Terms and Conditions, in particular the multiple simultaneous participation in games and the opening of several accounts, the company may exclude the respective user from placing further bets and from participating in other games. Any criminal or suspicious activities may be reported to the appropriate authorities.In such a case, the company will pay the user any real money balance in his betting account after deducting a handling charge of 10%, provided that this has been acquired in a lawful manner. FreeBets or winnings that may have resulted from FreeBets, which were not acquired in a lawful manner, will be void."

This seems to suggest if scenario (1) applies, you should get your "real money balance" less 10% - but it's not clear whether that's the initial deposit, or the actual balance. I'm not sure whether using funds from someone else's Moneybooker's automatically means that the winnings weren't acquired in a "lawful" manner; if they meant that, it would be easier to state "initial deposit" and not "real money balance." So - then it looks like your friend's account should be refunded the initial deposit minus 10%.

**BWINcomFraud** · 07-19-09, 05:28 AM

They stole from me 736eur and Bwin is a scam!
I can't comment on your particular complain, in my case I registered account in my name, deposited money from my credit cards with same addresse where cretit cards statements arrive. After I won and requested withdrawal to cretit card and bank account, Bwin closed my account and Bwin stole my money.
I can give you and others only one very good avise: Never give Bwin any money, never play there. Before opening new account, check SBR rating on bookmakers and play only with top rated. Also don't forget to write about your promblem with Bwin in your country on players forums, it seems you are from Lithuania (I was born in Vilnius, brother). Make your issue be heared, warn others.

http://www.mkapital.com/fraudBwin/

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**Justin7** · 07-19-09, 10:36 AM

Bwincom,

You should really explain all the facts if you are calling Bwin a fraud. Your credit cards were never successfully charged, and I don't know why. I probably won't find out until after the IBAS rules, at which point I'll take another swing at your dispute... But focus on facts.

**BWINcomFraud** · 07-19-09, 01:01 PM

I am expessing my own opinion, if you are affraid of Bwin's lawyers, forward them to me.
I will not allow Bwin to put pressure on players complaints using lawyers to scare cheated customers, it's based on my moral views, look in my link to German players accusations, how Bwin makes 2000EUR accounts worth 0.89EUR and doesn't reply.
Then customer says that nobody could use his account but him and the game where Bwin says he lost this 2000EUR, he never played.
He is long term Bwin customer and it came as a shock to him, that his funds 2000EUR went missing.
He doesn't exclude Bwin cheating him, even being their loyal customer as he said. He says this 2000EUR dissapeared after for the first time he won this amount (it looks like it's big money to him). Bwin says he played Poker and lost, but he never played Poker after winning this money, he wanted to withdraw this money. I imagine how a loyal customer feels, when winning big money are missing.
Please read it here http://www.kasinoforum.com/mb/proble...rug-hilfe.html , then translate it. I searched only German complaints, I wil move to other languages as well, it can't be all complaints written at different time from different countries lie. The fact that Bwin doesn't reply to such serious issues immediately or at all, it stinks like dead cat's meat after 2 weeks.
Why my cards were not charged?
Because they were not charged, but were accepted immediately after I deposited and shown on Bwin's playing screen as accepted.
Justin, don't be so naive, captain. No internet credit card transaction would be accepted, if something would be wrong.
I played for almost a week every day, and deposited from my cards money during this week 3-4 times, with **** and ********** in my name. Bwin plays stupid, but my issue only went to supervisor of GRA because they were contacted by editor of Panorama newspaper in Gibraltar. Besides **** and ********** have so sophisticated security checks, that if there would be anything wrong Bwin would never place this deposits to my account. If Bwin accepted my 3-4 deposits they will be held responsible to pay a winning customer.
I don't care of their lawyers, I want to get deeper into how this scam works so successfully. The problem arises from weak oversight, Bwin pays for license very nice amount every year to GRA. The amount of complaints is very big and compared to other betting companies in Gibraltar it's huge. I ask again, why Ladbrokes fraud or William Hill fraud couldn't be foun AT ALL. All complaints are about Bwin. How can I trust a company and not call it fraud if after betting on 30 sport bets and winning 736eur, the account is closed.
If Bwin would close my account and ban me for life, paying me my winning bets, I would not write a single complain.
You can do what you want, C- you rate Bwin is not fair. You can place Bwin on Blacklist and if they will send their lawyers team to you, tell them that your rating on them is based on the amount of complaints about them, when compared to other books of same size.
This is enough to be placed on blacklist, it shows that they are not doing any progress on it and customers have to write about being cheated by Bwin, in one way or another, on blogs, forums etc.
They deserve to be blacklisted only because of this complaints. For reputable company that they pretend to be, this is not acceptable in betting business as it shows that the money there are not safe and winning bets may not be paid for "security reason".
I hope you will do further reasearch on it and act fair. C- for 20 million accounts company is worse than D or F for company with 1000 customers, that's why you can be first to review your rating based on amount of such complaints.
Why Ladbrokes that have 4 times bigger revenues and probably 50 tore customers, don't have a single fraud or scam complain

**BWINcomFraud** · 07-19-09, 02:11 PM

Bwin fraud & scam: Now in Spanish

I searched on Google Bwin fraude Bwin estafa

Bwin empanada
Bwin embrollo
Bwin engaño
Bwin fraude
Bwin hermano
Bwin estafa

First complaint I found placed in 2005, same as me, this ex-Bwin customer ( I think he is not their customer today) is complaining how this scam runs so successfuly. Here is Spanish text, then English:

Hace unos dias me dio por apostar en una página de apuestas on-line, la mas conocida de todas y la que mas confianza me podía inspirar por su publicidad y demas era "BETANDWIN".
Pues bueno, ni en esa se puede confiar, ala hora de ingresar el dinero sin ningun problema, pero resulta que gane la apuesta y para cobrar te ponen una sucesiva serie de tramas de documentos que has de enviarles scaneados para retener tu dinero el maximo tiempo posible, te piden un documento con foto de tu identidad y al parecer el DNI no les vale... ahora me piden el pasaporte y dios dira que mas me pediran puesto que he investigado opiniones por internet y no soy el primero al que le pasa, asi que ya sabeis...
BETANDWIN ES UN FRAUDE.
Pensaba que eso de los timos por internet estaba ya mas controlado pero al parecer no.

Translation:
A few days ago I got to bet on a page on-line betting, the best known of all and that I could inspire more confidence in their advertising and so was "BetandWin.

Well, in that neither can be trusted, hang time you enter the money without any problem, but it is to win the bet and put you to collect a series of successive frames of documents you've scanned to send your money to retain the maximum time can you ask for a document with a photograph of your Identity Card and apparently not worth ... Now I ask God's passport and asked me to say since I have researched opinions on the internet and am not the first that happens, so you know ...

BetandWin is a fraud.

I thought that the internet scam was longer controlled but apparently not.
Link: http://el_espectador.blogia.com/2005...s-un-timo..php

Same blog 2007 complain:
BWIN es un fraude

A mi me pidieron el mismo papeleo para cobrar y en lugar de pagarme cerraron mi cuenta. Se hizieron tontos para contestar mi mail y nunca me pagaron.

Bwin Fraude fraude fraude

Translation:
BWIN is a fraud

I asked the same paperwork to collect and pay in lieu of closing my account. Hizieron be foolish to answer my mail and never paid me.

Bwin Fraud fraud fraud

I don't know Spanish, this is just additional links for those interested.

**RogueJuror** · 07-19-09, 02:58 PM

orale mijo

chinguen su pinche madre

**BWINcomFraud** · 07-19-09, 04:15 PM

Originally posted by RogueJuror

orale mijo

chinguen su pinche madre

You can call me mother ****er, this is your right to free speech. I am not calling your mother in any bad word as I have nothing against you or even more your mother. I wish God have a mercy upon you and forgive you, but if you are so angry about my post linking to other posts about Bwin's fraud or you are in any way connected with them, be so kind and forward to them:
On Monday I will have a phone conversation with my lawyer again, who brought to justice biggers scamsters than Bwin and won in one divorce case close to a billion $, compared to Bwin, it was much more complicated case.
It doesn't matter if they will return my winnings or not, I am launching on them case for wire fraud, moral pressure, stealing of my money, lies and false accusation and much more. Tell Bwin to prepare accordingly and accusation their lawyer wrote to me are very serious accusations that will cost them dearly and probably will break them. As after me, all previously cheated customers will have an example. I never went to court even if I had few occasions, I am not fighter for a small reason, but this time is different.
Read what they accuse me of and think of how much they will have to pay for it, when I will prove it very easy, that this is a lie.
Tell your friends that jokes finished, now it's for real. Best wishes to your mother, little nazi boy who covers his face like big mafia when I am sure one kick in the ass would be enough. Or you are on TOP WANTED by CIA list? ; )

**RogueJuror** · 07-19-09, 04:18 PM

relax - i said chinguen bwin

im on your side, fight the power, pls dont call authorities on me

**BWINcomFraud** · 07-19-09, 04:40 PM

Then I am very sorry, please forgive me! I translated it on Google translator and some words were translated as **** your mother or something like this. You can translate it yourself and see how it looks in english.

http://translate.google.com/translate_t#es|en|%20mijo%0D%0A%0D%0Achinguen%20su%20pinche%20madre

Again, I am very sorry.
If there are more customers of Bwin who's accounts were closed for no reason and winnings were not paid, I will include you in my case, even if my lawyer have said that my case looks very sure to him, because of not only Bwin stole my money, they accuse me through their lawyer that I used fraudulent credit cards that were not mine and other details I provided to Bwin were false. He said this is very serious. Bwin made uncalculated bet against me, that will cost them more than all the money they stole from other people combined.
I will keep you updated to as much as I will be allowed by my lawyer, we did not filled lawsuit yet but we are gathering information.
I thought that Bwin will have to pay so much for all their decade long fraud, that it will be enough to split between all of us who fell a victim to their sophisticated fraud. There is Bwin with hundred lawyers and there are facts, let's see what judge (jurisdiction will most probably be Gibraltar, this case needs an attention from financial regulators of all kinds, **********, ****, auditors etc.etc. and Gambling Commission and I think this is were fraud against me occured plus their competitors will have a show and other fraudsters will must watch out) will look at.

http://www.mkapital.com/fraudBwin/

This website is for sale! mkapital.com is your first and best source for all of the information you’re looking for. From general topics to more of what you would expect to find here, mkapital.com has it all. We hope you find what you are searching for!

After the case will be filled, it will be too late for others to join it, while they still have rights to file their own claims with their lawyers.
Don't allow Bwin steal from you, if you was not paid in the end, don't give up. Even 10$ cheat can turn to million $ if you can prove it.
All bets and transactions are stored on the servers, the facts are the facts. Don't be afraid of Bwin, for the judge all people are the same!
ROGUEJUROR, I see you know Spanish, if there are more info you can get on Bwin fraud in Spanish as you know better how to run a search on Google in Spanish, or post it here or if you are afraid of Bwin's lawyers, e-mail it to me, I will place it.
Cordially, MM.

**InTheHole** · 07-19-09, 04:59 PM

**Slim** · 07-19-09, 10:38 PM

AC Milan is touting BWIN on their jerseys. Watch Live Los Angeles Galaxy vs AC Milan (en)

**BWINcomFraud** · 07-20-09, 05:01 AM

Originally posted by Slim

AC Milan is touting BWIN on their jerseys. Watch Live Los Angeles Galaxy vs AC Milan (en)

Great!