DeMar DeRozan

**Bostongambler** · 02-27-22, 08:07 PM

Originally posted by thomorino

Embiid dominated on both sides of the ball. He had 4 blocks as well. The last time Jokic had 4 blocks was 3 months ago.

Embiid is the clear mvp.

The Harden trade has just made it easier for him to score and Porter was just cleared for on court play so Jokic's usuage rate will go down significantly moving forward.

The writers don't like to give the same player the MVP twice, they like to elevate new players. If Embiid doesn't get hurt the award is his.

Yes, but you are the boob who sold out of a 650 payout. The guy who always talks about value gave it all back.

**stevenash** · 02-27-22, 08:34 PM

Originally posted by thomorino

The writers don't like to give the same player the MVP twice, they like to elevate new players. If Embiid doesn't get hurt the award is his.

He's tenth in the league in blocks, big deal.
And you know better that to compare Embid to Jokic who is not a down low defender.
Apples to oranges bud, apple to oranges.

He shot like crap today, he depended on foul shots to pad those stats, rebounding was nothing special either.

But if you say he wins by default because Jokic isn't allowed to win again, well there you have it.
The only player to have a season better this year in the history of the NBA is Jordan, and the writers know it.
And Jokic is the only player in the league that makes his team ten points better. That's value, as in MVP
Jokic is top ten in every offensive category, Embid is not.

Facts, are facts.
Embid is having a nice season, tied with Giannis for second.
Jokic is having a career season.

The facts do the talking for me.
Liars figure, and figures don't lie.

**thomorino** · 02-27-22, 08:38 PM

Originally posted by Bostongambler

Yes, but you are the boob who sold out of a 650 payout. The guy who always talks about value gave it all back.

I explained to you 3 time why that's not true. I sold less than 25% of my Embiid to be MVP holdings, and I solid these holding at +200 for a 300% profit.

**thomorino** · 02-27-22, 08:39 PM

Originally posted by stevenash

He's tenth in the league in blocks, big deal.
And you know better that to compare Embid to Jokic who is not a down low defender.
Apples to oranges bud, apple to oranges.

He shot like crap today, he depended on foul shots to pad those stats, rebounding was nothing special either.

But if you say he wins by default because Jokic isn't allowed to win again, well there you have it.
The only player to have a season better this year in the history of the NBA is Jordan, and the writers know it.
And Jokic is the only player in the league that makes his team ten points better. That's value, as in MVP
Jokic is top ten in every offensive category, Embid is not.

Facts, are facts.
Embid is having a nice season, tied with Giannis for second.
Jokic is having a career season.

The facts do the talking for me.
Liars figure, and figures don't lie.

Embiid is having the best season a center has had in over 30 years, and he's dominating on both sides of the ball. Jokic can't defend and his usuage rate will drop significantly when Porter comes back.

**stevenash** · 02-27-22, 09:18 PM

Originally posted by thomorino

The writers don't like to give the same player the MVP twice, they like to elevate new players. If Embiid doesn't get hurt the award is his.

Nash won consecutive MVP's
Lebron won consecutive MVP's
Curry won consecutive MVP's
Giannis won consecutive MVP's

Did the writers make an exception for those players.

Giannis is the only player ever to win Defensive Player of the Year is Giannis, and Embid hasn't done either.

**thomorino** · 02-27-22, 09:39 PM

Originally posted by stevenash

Nash won consecutive MVP's
Lebron won consecutive MVP's
Curry won consecutive MVP's
Giannis won consecutive MVP's

Did the writers make an exception for those players.

Giannis is the only player ever to win Defensive Player of the Year is Giannis, and Embid hasn't done either.

Those teams had the best record in the NBA or a top 3 record - Denver isn't even close - and the writers very rarely give the MVP to a player who isn't on a top 5 team. Extremely rarely.

**stevenash** · 02-27-22, 09:48 PM

Originally posted by thomorino

Those teams had the best record in the NBA or a top 3 record - Denver isn't even close - and the writers very rarely give the MVP to a player who isn't on a top 5 team. Extremely rarely.

That's not what you said, you got caught and now you're trying to change your original statement.
Again.

You said the writers don't like to give the same players twice.
It's been done three times in the past 12 years.

My facts do my debating for me.

**thomorino** · 02-27-22, 10:04 PM

Originally posted by stevenash

That's not what you said, you got caught and now you're trying to change your original statement.
Again.

You said the writers don't like to give the same players twice.
It's been done three times in the past 12 years.

My facts do my debating for me.

No, an MVP has repeated as MVP only when they've been thoroughly dominant and on a top team - again the Writers prefer to give the award to new players - as I said.

**thomorino** · 02-27-22, 10:04 PM

Jokic has 4 points against a G-league roster.

The debate over who the better player between him and Embiid is, ended a while ago.

**d2bets** · 02-27-22, 10:30 PM

Originally posted by thomorino

Embiid is having the best season a center has had in over 30 years, and he's dominating on both sides of the ball. Jokic can't defend and his usuage rate will drop significantly when Porter comes back.

Shaq 99-00 was one vote short of being only unanimous MVP.

**stevenash** · 02-27-22, 10:54 PM

Originally posted by d2bets

Shaq 99-00 was one vote short of being only unanimous MVP.

Get this, halfway through the third quarter, on the second night of a back to back yet, Jokic has 19/11/8
ON FIVE FG ATTEMPTS

It's inevitbable, on back to back nights, he's going to post consecutive triple/triples.
He's the best all around player on the planet.
Just 3 for 5 from the field and he's posting a triple/triple.
Are you serious?

**Bostongambler** · 02-27-22, 11:02 PM

Originally posted by stevenash

Get this, halfway through the third quarter, on the second night of a back to back yet, Jokic has 19/11/8
ON FIVE FG ATTEMPTS

It's inevitbable, on back to back nights, he's going to post consecutive triple/triples.
He's the best all around player on the planet.
Just 3 for 5 from the field and he's posting a triple/triple.
Are you serious?

Denver up 23 in the 4th so he might not get back into the game. Has 8 points , 18 rebounds and 11 assists in 26 minutes played. See if he gets back in the game.

**thomorino** · 02-27-22, 11:11 PM

Jokic had 8 points against a G-League Portland team. It looks like he is starting to wear down. It will be interesting to see if Denver rests him on the second night of back to backs moving forwad.

Embiid scored 8 points in the first quarter.

**thomorino** · 02-27-22, 11:11 PM

Originally posted by d2bets

Shaq 99-00 was one vote short of being only unanimous MVP.

Embiid's season this year is better than Shaq's years in 99-00 in every way.

**thomorino** · 02-27-22, 11:22 PM

Westbrook over 16.5 points -120 live player prop

**stevenash** · 02-27-22, 11:22 PM

Originally posted by Bostongambler

Denver up 23 in the 4th so he might not get back into the game. Has 8 points , 18 rebounds and 11 assists in 26 minutes played. See if he gets back in the game.

No, this is the last run.
Malone just put in the end of the bench, the scrubs or the scrubs.

Malone is all class, he and Jokic doesn't need it on a back to back.
He would have put up pinball numbers if he played his whole 34 minutes.
Know that.

Rivers put in Embid the other night up 20 points just so Embid could get his 10th rebound.
Rivers is an idiot for doing that.

**thomorino** · 02-27-22, 11:26 PM

Originally posted by stevenash

No, this is the last run.
Malone just put in the end of the bench, the scrubs or the scrubs.

Malone is all class, he and Jokic doesn't need it on a back to back.
He would have put up pinball numbers if he played his whole 34 minutes.
Know that.

Rivers put in Embid the other night up 20 points just so Embid could get his 10th rebound.
Rivers is an idiot for doing that.

No he didn't. Embiid came in at the 9 minute mark in the 4th against Minnesota.

**thomorino** · 02-27-22, 11:34 PM

Embiid now averages almost 4 more points per game after Jokic's 8 point game.

This is could turn into a rout in the next week, Embiid's numbers are only going to get bigger playing with Harden. He's much harder to double now.

**thomorino** · 02-27-22, 11:39 PM

Embiid is now leading the league in scoring

**Chi_archie** · 02-28-22, 01:56 AM

**d2bets** · 02-28-22, 09:18 AM

Originally posted by thomorino

Embiid's season this year is better than Shaq's years in 99-00 in every way.

**stevenash** · 02-28-22, 10:05 AM

Originally posted by d2bets

That's almost as ludicrous as proclaiming Embid the third greatest center of all time.
He's a top three center in 2022.

**stevenash** · 02-28-22, 10:18 AM

Originally posted by thomorino

Embiid is having the best season a center has had in over 30 years, and he's dominating on both sides of the ball. Jokic can't defend and his usuage rate will drop significantly when Porter comes back.

I don't think you know how NBA advanced metrics are calculated, or what they mean.
More times than not a high USG% is not a good thing.
I'll explain the math to you and why if you want.

And you clearly don't know what +/- is.

**thomorino** · 02-28-22, 12:33 PM

Originally posted by stevenash

I don't think you know how NBA advanced metrics are calculated, or what they mean.
More times than not a high USG% is not a good thing.
I'll explain the math to you and why if you want.

And you clearly don't know what +/- is.

Embiid averages nearly 4 more points than Jokic - I can explain to you what ppg means so that helps you understand the multiple ways Embiid has been better than Jokic.

Embiid is also now +100 to win the MVP, he's running away with the MVP award not just in reality but also in the betting markets.

**thomorino** · 02-28-22, 12:37 PM

Shaq 99 00

Shaq had a player efficiency rating of 30.6, and compiled 29.7 points, 13.6 rebounds, 3.8 assists, and 3.0 blocks per game. Those numbers were career bests in each category but blocks and rebounds.

Embiid averages more points and assists, and his per is almost 10% higher than Shaq's was that in 99-00. Embiid's PER This year is 32.25

So - Embiid averages more points, more assists, his efficiency rating is significantly higher than Shaq's was that year too.

There seems to be a lack of basic awareness of how basketball and analytics work in this thread with you 2.

**thomorino** · 02-28-22, 12:38 PM

As long as he doesn't get hurt Embiid likely the MVP race will likely end within a week or 2.

Embiid is down to +100.

**thomorino** · 02-28-22, 12:46 PM

Originally posted by stevenash

That's almost as ludicrous as proclaiming Embid the third greatest center of all time.
He's a top three center in 2022.

I said Embiid is a top 5 all-time center - and that's not debateable

**thomorino** · 02-28-22, 12:48 PM

Embiid's PER is literally almost 10% higher than Shaq was in 99-00.

Embiid is having a better season - and its not close.

Shaq couldn't hit a 10 foot shot, Embiid scores from every point of the floor including 3 pointers.

**RonPaul2008** · 02-28-22, 01:03 PM

Correct me if i'm wrong, but the league average for points is significantly higher now then in shaq's day.

Originally posted by thomorino

Shaq 99 00

Shaq had a player efficiency rating of 30.6, and compiled 29.7 points, 13.6 rebounds, 3.8 assists, and 3.0 blocks per game. Those numbers were career bests in each category but blocks and rebounds.

Embiid averages more points and assists, and his per is almost 10% higher than Shaq's was that in 99-00. Embiid's PER This year is 32.25

So - Embiid averages more points, more assists, his efficiency rating is significantly higher than Shaq's was that year too.

There seems to be a lack of basic awareness of how basketball and analytics work in this thread with you 2.

**d2bets** · 02-28-22, 01:09 PM

Originally posted by thomorino

Shaq 99 00

Shaq had a player efficiency rating of 30.6, and compiled 29.7 points, 13.6 rebounds, 3.8 assists, and 3.0 blocks per game. Those numbers were career bests in each category but blocks and rebounds.

Embiid averages more points and assists, and his per is almost 10% higher than Shaq's was that in 99-00. Embiid's PER This year is 32.25

So - Embiid averages more points, more assists, his efficiency rating is significantly higher than Shaq's was that year too.

There seems to be a lack of basic awareness of how basketball and analytics work in this thread with you 2.

And Jokic PER is higher than Embiid this season. #1 of all-time right now. So is Giannis. The 3 PER seasons all-time are this season. You just can't compare that with past seasons. It's a different game now than it was then.

How about if we look at player win shares?

**d2bets** · 02-28-22, 01:10 PM

Originally posted by thomorino

Embiid's PER is literally almost 10% higher than Shaq was in 99-00.

Embiid is having a better season - and its not close.

Shaq couldn't hit a 10 foot shot, Embiid scores from every point of the floor including 3 pointers.

Well then you just proved Jokic is having a better season that Embiid, since his PER is higher.

**stevenash** · 02-28-22, 01:25 PM

Originally posted by thomorino

I said Embiid is a top 5 all-time center - and that's not debateable

It's 100 percent debatable, and it's already been proven.
And I'm pretty sure you said top three, but I'll check later.

So, you were saying earlier the voters don't like to vote in consecutive back to back MVP's and we all said it's happened several times after Nash did it, than you tried to walk back that and said, yeah, but they were on contenders.

So what it is now, you can't win an MVP award in consecutive seasons unless you are on a contender, than it's OK?

**stevenash** · 02-28-22, 01:34 PM

Originally posted by thomorino

Embiid averages nearly 4 more points than Jokic - I can explain to you what ppg means so that helps you understand the multiple ways Embiid has been better than Jokic.

Embiid is also now +100 to win the MVP, he's running away with the MVP award not just in reality but also in the betting markets.

Multiple ways, he has a higher scoring average, that's it.
Don't feed me blocked shots, that's an ancillary stat, and he doesn't even lead the league in that.

The whole board isn't buying what you're selling, and the only one who does, is you.
Shocker again, huh?

Just stop.

You can't even explain +/- or USG%.
Don't try a professional math geek with your razzle dazzle, it doesn't work.

Please, just stop.
Unless you want yet another time out, because you'll snap.
Again.

**thomorino** · 02-28-22, 01:41 PM

Originally posted by RonPaul2008

Correct me if i'm wrong, but the league average for points is significantly higher now then in shaq's day.

Yeah, that's why I cited Per - which takes that into consideration - Embiid is much more efficient than Shaq was that year - again its not close.

**thomorino** · 02-28-22, 01:42 PM

Originally posted by d2bets

Well then you just proved Jokic is having a better season that Embiid, since his PER is higher.

No I didn't because Per doesn't adequatley measure defense and, again, Embiid was hurt earlier in the season.

The fact that Per doesn't measure defense matters for the Jokic-Embiid comparison because Embiid is the far better defender, Embiid is a better defender than Shaq was too.