After exactly one month I was paid my balance from Bwin and my account will remain closed. The figure was high (6,885 euros). I would still be waiting if it wasn't for Justin to which I want to express my gratitude.
I have no problem with the account remaining closed, as I am scared to play there anymore, but since I had done absolutely nothing wrong, I would have expected that any semi-serious book would keep it open, apologise and probably offer some big bonus too to make sure I would stick with them for a while despite their ridiculous behaviour all this time. But make no mistake, Bwin is not a semi-serious book, this is a joke of a sportsbook where you could be accused of anything without any substance whatsoever and there is nothing you can do about it either.
A summary of what had happened: I played poker against my parents (they play together from an account under the name of my mother, my dad believes she is 'luckier', go figure) and they lucked out and won around 400 euro from me. This was considered chip-dumping. Now you tell me why a person that had around 5.5k euros in their account would only chip-dump 400 euros to their supposed 'second account' to drive it from 100 euros to 500??? They had depositted that 100 the same day, so why would they not deposit the whole 500 if that extra 400 was the problem? Do they seriously believe that if that was a second account, a person that plays 300-400 a bet frequently (and has dozens of 1000 euro bets also) would have any problem to deposit the additional 400? To proove that I also sent Justin the history of my Neteller account around those days. I had over 2k in there (which I haven't used since) in my neteller account so would I not send the money to their Neteller account for them to deposit instead? To make things worse I also had money on another Ongame poker network skin(can also provide the proof for this), so it is only logical to assume that if I wanted to chip-dump, I would have used that account.
What clearly shows the icompetence of the Bwin people though is the poker play itself. We paid rake that would far exceed the Moneybookers fees for a transfer of such little money or the Neteller fees. Apart from that, I knew my parents are horrible players and therefore will play a bit silly-tight with little money before them and would loosen up considerably if they had more money (seeing all streets). Tied after the flop of course, because before the flop they call with most of their hands. So, I tried to make them fold on an A-high board knowing that with that little money before them they will always raise an ace, fool around for a little with a draw and then fold the turn, so I bet the flop and then shoved the turn and they go and call me with a silly 3rd pair (I had q-6) of 8s. This was for their first double-up. Now, I wonder, if 2 people are going to chip-dump, do they shove on a turn where if a Q comes on the river, the person that supposedly wanted to lose, goes on and wins the whole balance of its opponent???
The other significant hand was one where I had top pair and there were a myriad draws on the flop and the flush card hit on the turn and i slowed down, then the river comes an innocuous 4 which completes absolutely no draws and I know for a fact that if they had the flush they wouldn't bet much in order not to lose a customer. They have a busted draw with some silly 2rd-3rd or something like that pair there nearly 90% of the time if they bet alot there, I am not playing Phil Ivey. So, I called them down with my top pair and they indeed didn't have the flush but they had made a miraculous 2 pair on the river with their 94 off! Against these players I would play the same every time.
A 5 year old kid could check the poker play and conclude there was no way chip-dumping was going on. There were not raise-reraise-fold hands (to avoid rake) or check-to-the-river hands etc. Yet, the Bwin people were 'investigating' for 30 days and couldn't conclude.
What is even more annoying though is that they take advantadge of people. My parents just went on and bet their money as usual and they have little problem going broke with their account as they have never told me about any withdrawals, they have only made deposits then piss it all away to sports then redeposit etc. They thought they are doing something wrong with the internet when they saw their account is also blocked. When I asked them to check their account to see if that was indeed the problem behind mine being blocked, it was only then they realised their was blocked as well. They just went on with their summer vacation after that and never bothered with the little money they had in there. So, when this finally ended for me I asked them again to check their email and tell me at what point is their account? Have they been refunded the money? Is it perhaps open, etc? And there I discover that Bwin HAS NEVER SENT THEM ONE EMAIL ABOUT THIS. Nothing. After 31 days, they haven't even let them know they have blocked the account. Nevermind send them their money. They just went on and tried to steal the uninformed, almost internet-illiteterate old people out of their money and see if that sticks. If this isn't an act of a crook, I don't know what it is.
I have no problem with the account remaining closed, as I am scared to play there anymore, but since I had done absolutely nothing wrong, I would have expected that any semi-serious book would keep it open, apologise and probably offer some big bonus too to make sure I would stick with them for a while despite their ridiculous behaviour all this time. But make no mistake, Bwin is not a semi-serious book, this is a joke of a sportsbook where you could be accused of anything without any substance whatsoever and there is nothing you can do about it either.
A summary of what had happened: I played poker against my parents (they play together from an account under the name of my mother, my dad believes she is 'luckier', go figure) and they lucked out and won around 400 euro from me. This was considered chip-dumping. Now you tell me why a person that had around 5.5k euros in their account would only chip-dump 400 euros to their supposed 'second account' to drive it from 100 euros to 500??? They had depositted that 100 the same day, so why would they not deposit the whole 500 if that extra 400 was the problem? Do they seriously believe that if that was a second account, a person that plays 300-400 a bet frequently (and has dozens of 1000 euro bets also) would have any problem to deposit the additional 400? To proove that I also sent Justin the history of my Neteller account around those days. I had over 2k in there (which I haven't used since) in my neteller account so would I not send the money to their Neteller account for them to deposit instead? To make things worse I also had money on another Ongame poker network skin(can also provide the proof for this), so it is only logical to assume that if I wanted to chip-dump, I would have used that account.
What clearly shows the icompetence of the Bwin people though is the poker play itself. We paid rake that would far exceed the Moneybookers fees for a transfer of such little money or the Neteller fees. Apart from that, I knew my parents are horrible players and therefore will play a bit silly-tight with little money before them and would loosen up considerably if they had more money (seeing all streets). Tied after the flop of course, because before the flop they call with most of their hands. So, I tried to make them fold on an A-high board knowing that with that little money before them they will always raise an ace, fool around for a little with a draw and then fold the turn, so I bet the flop and then shoved the turn and they go and call me with a silly 3rd pair (I had q-6) of 8s. This was for their first double-up. Now, I wonder, if 2 people are going to chip-dump, do they shove on a turn where if a Q comes on the river, the person that supposedly wanted to lose, goes on and wins the whole balance of its opponent???
The other significant hand was one where I had top pair and there were a myriad draws on the flop and the flush card hit on the turn and i slowed down, then the river comes an innocuous 4 which completes absolutely no draws and I know for a fact that if they had the flush they wouldn't bet much in order not to lose a customer. They have a busted draw with some silly 2rd-3rd or something like that pair there nearly 90% of the time if they bet alot there, I am not playing Phil Ivey. So, I called them down with my top pair and they indeed didn't have the flush but they had made a miraculous 2 pair on the river with their 94 off! Against these players I would play the same every time.
A 5 year old kid could check the poker play and conclude there was no way chip-dumping was going on. There were not raise-reraise-fold hands (to avoid rake) or check-to-the-river hands etc. Yet, the Bwin people were 'investigating' for 30 days and couldn't conclude.
What is even more annoying though is that they take advantadge of people. My parents just went on and bet their money as usual and they have little problem going broke with their account as they have never told me about any withdrawals, they have only made deposits then piss it all away to sports then redeposit etc. They thought they are doing something wrong with the internet when they saw their account is also blocked. When I asked them to check their account to see if that was indeed the problem behind mine being blocked, it was only then they realised their was blocked as well. They just went on with their summer vacation after that and never bothered with the little money they had in there. So, when this finally ended for me I asked them again to check their email and tell me at what point is their account? Have they been refunded the money? Is it perhaps open, etc? And there I discover that Bwin HAS NEVER SENT THEM ONE EMAIL ABOUT THIS. Nothing. After 31 days, they haven't even let them know they have blocked the account. Nevermind send them their money. They just went on and tried to steal the uninformed, almost internet-illiteterate old people out of their money and see if that sticks. If this isn't an act of a crook, I don't know what it is.
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