Seeking opinions on XFL prop wager at betonline.ag

[washhead]

I'm curious to hear people's thoughts on a recent wager at betonline.ag:


XFL Futures - XFL cease operations during 2020 Season -


This wager was graded as a "Yes," and I'm curious what others think.

In my mind, to "cease operations" means to dissolve as an organization, like what happened with the AAF last year.

The XFL still has employees, and they still have a headquarters. They are still paying their players and are committed to coming back in 2021 and beyond: https://www.xfl.com/en-US/articles/xfl-statement

To me, this is not an organization that has ceased operating.

I asked BOL and their response wasn't entirely clear: "at the time the bet remain on the currently status, however we need to wait until new developments due to the pandemic situation and if the bet comes to be winner we will be able to re-grade it by that time." I asked if they could clarify what that means, and I have not heard back after three days.

I'm curious if others think I have an argument. BOL has reversed decisions like this in the past after I've posted here. Thanks for any thoughts.

[caramba]

Should still be pending. Absolutely not settled as yes.

[HedgeHog]

It's another poorly worded prop at BOL. My take on it is that "yes" wins if the 2020 season is not completed. If the XFL comes back this year and finishes the season then "no" wins as the season would merely be postponed. Just my 2 cents.

[pologq]

cease operations to me means it shuts down as a league

this is just the cancellation of a season

[PD77]

It's another poorly worded prop at BOL. My take on it is that "yes" wins if the 2020 season is not completed. If the XFL comes back this year and finishes the season then "no" wins as the season would merely be postponed. Just my 2 cents.

Agree its poorly worded but if the NBA fails to finish the 2019-20 season did the NBA cease operations? I think this prop was based off of the 2001 XFL season. "The original XFL ceased operations entirely in May 2001. Its closure was announced just a few weeks after the league's season championship game, in which the Los Angeles Xtreme defeated the San Francisco Demons, on April 21, 2001, at the Los Angeles Memorial Coliseum."

As long as the XFL comes back next year they didnt cease operations, of course there is a possibility that they wont come back even though they are planning on it.

[washhead]

Agreed. I'm almost certain the intent of this wager was whether or not the new XFL would fold like it did in 2001 or the AAF last year.

Still waiting on a response from BOL clarifying their position. I also submitted an SBR complaint form on March 15.

[HedgeHog]

Agree its poorly worded but if the NBA fails to finish the 2019-20 season did the NBA cease operations? I think this prop was based off of the 2001 XFL season. "The original XFL ceased operations entirely in May 2001. Its closure was announced just a few weeks after the league's season championship game, in which the Los Angeles Xtreme defeated the San Francisco Demons, on April 21, 2001, at the Los Angeles Memorial Coliseum."

As long as the XFL comes back next year they didnt cease operations, of course there is a possibility that they wont come back even though they are planning on it.

Pologq and you make persuasive points to let the bet stand until next season. If the bet gets reinstated and the XFL issues a statement after Jan 1 that it is ceasing operations permanently, how does the bet get graded? Did they cease in 2020 or 2021? As I said the prop is ambiguous. Voiding it and refunding all wagers may be the proper call here.

[Optional]

In my mind, to "cease operations" means to dissolve as an organization

I can see why you would assume that.

But can also see why a league stopping for COVID-19 has been graded as ceasing operations too. As they are now not operating.

[washhead]

I can see why you would assume that.

But can also see why a league stopping for COVID-19 has been graded as ceasing operations too. As they are now not operating.

According to their statement, the XFL is currently paying players for the full season. Paying your employees sure sounds like business operations to me.

[Optional]

According to their statement, the XFL is currently paying players for the full season. Paying your employees sure sounds like business operations to me.

If the bet said business operations maybe.

I do get where you are coming from, and pretty much agree with you, but it's not clear enough to say for sure. And this is a very weird situation that has arisen and it's not that surprising ambiguities like this are going to be popping up for other season long bets as well.

BOL look after you either way.

[PD77]

It’s so poorly worded that if you applied it to the 2001 XFL season instead of 2020 you could still make an argument that the XFL did not cease operations DURING the season, it was after the season ended.

It’s only a matter of time before the ambiguous COVID-19/Coronavirus futures start rolling in. Who comes up with these crazy future bets anyway?

[washhead]

If the bet said business operations maybe.

I do get where you are coming from, and pretty much agree with you, but it's not clear enough to say for sure. And this is a very weird situation that has arisen and it's not that surprising ambiguities like this are going to be popping up for other season long bets as well.

BOL look after you either way.

I agree that it isn't clear enough one way or another. At this point I'd gladly take a cancellation, even though I think this should be a winner. A little disappointed I haven't heard from them in four days.

[Optional]

I agree that it isn't clear enough one way or another. At this point I'd gladly take a cancellation, even though I think this should be a winner. A little disappointed I haven't heard from them in four days.

If you send in a sportsbook complaint form with your account ID we can give a manger in there a nudge for you.

[washhead]

If you send in a sportsbook complaint form with your account ID we can give a manger in there a nudge for you.

I filled one out on March 15. Waiting to hear back.

[garyking]

Poorly worded... Cease definition: to stop or discontinue. This has definitely happened. If they meant would the XFL go out of business a better word would have been "fold".

[washhead]

"Cease" isn't the key word of the wager, it's "operations." The season "ceased" before it was scheduled to, no question about it. But the league is still operating and plans to come back. The season ended early; "operations" did not.

[mrpapageorgio]

By saying ceased operations, they were going with the fancy legal wording to mean will they go out of business before the season is over. From what I understand, the league hasn't gone out of business, they've just done what the NHL and NBA are doing, and nobody is arguing those leagues went out of business. Playing the games is just one part of their operations (a major one, but not the only thing they do).

The part where it gets hairy is if the XFL decides to call the season early and then go out of business later in the year. If just the XFL suspended the season and then later goes out of business, you could then argue they suspended their season the same way a presidential candidate "suspends" their campaign. They're really ending it. However, since all the pro leagues are suspending their season, it's hard to argue that scenario since everyone suspended their season and maybe the XFL was legitimate in just suspending, but business conditions changed over time that made continuing not worth it.

If BOL wants to pick one winner and loser, they should just leave the bet pending and see if they start up another season in 2021. I can't see an issue though if they just void the bets considering an extenuating circumstances or they could offer good will and make both sides a winner like they have done before on certain odd prop bets that had controversy (they did this most recently for the last Dem debate when there was controversy when Biden and Sanders touched elbows, but was it considered done during the debate or before).

[deltgen]

I'm curious washhead--what were the lines on that wager?

[washhead]

Oh, I laid a ton of juice. I'm embarrassed to say.


No word yet from BOL or SBR.

[washhead]

I received a response, sort of. It was an email with the betonline.ag logo, followed by white space. No text whatsoever. Thanks BOL!

[washhead]

An actual response from BOL:

"Thank you for contacting us. Kindly accept my apologies for the inconvenience that this may have caused. I wish to inform you that the wager was correctly graded. This is because you slevted NO and XFL has ceased operation until further notice.

Any further questions or doubts you may have regarding this matter, please call us at 1-888-426-3661 or you may engage us on a Live Chat with one of our agents, for further assistance. Here at Bet Online your satisfaction is our main goal."

If their stance is that this is "until further notice," then why grade it now? Why not leave it pending? If the XFL comes back in 2021 will they reverse the decision (I suspect they won't)? I sent one more response, but I'm not hopeful.

I feel like I've been done dirty by BOL.

[PD77]

So according to BO all sports leagues have ceased operations. NBA,NFL,NHL, etc etc. now that is news!

[DontTailMe]

OP is 100% correct. You have to squint really hard from 1000 yards away to consider the XFL to have "ceased operations". That's just a ridiculous standard. Every reasonable person understands "cease operations" to mean close up shop.

[HedgeHog]

Stay away from online casinos and BOL props. They're both rigged. BOL intentionally states their props poorly so they can grade them to their advantage. It happens over and over again with this book. As written, the bet should be canceled. At this point the OP has not won the bet yet nor has he lost it, since the 2021 XFL season is not a given. I would urge SBR to act on OP's behalf to get this bet canceled.

[cyclingbettor]

Omg, the NBA and NHL have ceased operations!

[PD77]

Stay away from online casinos and BOL props. They're both rigged. BOL intentionally states their props poorly so they can grade them to their advantage. It happens over and over again with this book. As written, the bet should be canceled. At this point the OP has not won the bet yet nor has he lost it, since the 2021 XFL season is not a given. I would urge SBR to act on OP's behalf to get this bet canceled.

The way it’s worded I say he actually won the bet. The XFL season is over (prematurely) but they are still operating and paying players. Even if they cease operations before the 2021 season, it didn’t happen DURING the shortened 2020 season.

[rangerz2478]

Lol just another day in the life of betonline.

[Optional]

An actual response from BOL:

"Thank you for contacting us. Kindly accept my apologies for the inconvenience that this may have caused. I wish to inform you that the wager was correctly graded. This is because you slevted NO and XFL has ceased operation until further notice.

Any further questions or doubts you may have regarding this matter, please call us at 1-888-426-3661 or you may engage us on a Live Chat with one of our agents, for further assistance. Here at Bet Online your satisfaction is our main goal."

If their stance is that this is "until further notice," then why grade it now? Why not leave it pending? If the XFL comes back in 2021 will they reverse the decision (I suspect they won't)? I sent one more response, but I'm not hopeful.

I feel like I've been done dirty by BOL.

I think you said earlier that a BOL rep told you this grading would be re-assessed if the season resumes?

This rep sounds like they are implying that too to me.


I agree it seems weird to have graded bets now if that is the case, but if that is their plan at least it means you will be paid properly and as you expected at "season end". (or when its clearly announced by XFL I guess)

Which is pretty much what was going to happen anyway...

[DontTailMe]

"I wish to inform you that the wager was correctly graded." doesn't sound like they're leaving it open ended at all. And even if that is what they're saying, it's not the correct solution. OP shouldn't have to challenge this at a later time. He's currently wronged because they clearly haven't ceased operations, yet they've already given him a loss.

To be clear, I'm a big BOL fan and supporter. But they've made a clear grading error here and it should be remedied now, not later.

[Optional]

"I wish to inform you that the wager was correctly graded." doesn't sound like they're leaving it open ended at all. And even if that is what they're saying, it's not the correct solution. OP shouldn't have to challenge this at a later time. He's currently wronged because they clearly haven't ceased operations, yet they've already given him a loss.

They will have to reverse winners if it resumes as well. It does seem premature to me too.

Someone in there must have been super confident the season was done for sure.

If they do come back, we'll just have to deal with it then. :\

[washhead]

Is SBR willing to intervene, or do I basically just need to take this one in the shorts? I filed a complaint but haven't heard back.

[Optional]

Is SBR willing to intervene, or do I basically just need to take this one in the shorts? I filed a complaint but haven't heard back.

I honestly don't think there are grounds for SBR to do anything.

Like I said, if they review the decision if the season resumes, your bet would still be paid at the same time as otherwise. You are not inconvenienced at all so far based on the situation when you placed the bet.


Plus those on the other side have the completely opposite opinion to you.

Check the other thread at the top of the forum right now complaining these type of futures should be graded right now, as obviously the seasons are not going to be resumed. All those people think you are wrong here.

Why don't you go and argue directly with them and see if we can all work out who is correct?

https://www.sportsbookreview.com/forum/sportsbooks-industry/3597074-why-wont-books-refund-futures-bets-already-nba-nhl.html

[mrpapageorgio]

They will have to reverse winners if it resumes as well. It does seem premature to me too.

Someone in there must have been super confident the season was done for sure.

If they do come back, we'll just have to deal with it then. :\

The bet is whether the XFL would go out of business before the season was completed. It didn't go out of business. If it did, then so did the NBA and NHL since they're in the same limbo as the XFL. All 3 of suspended operations, not ceased. There's a difference between suspending operations and ceasing operations with the former being temporary and the latter being permanent. The wording of the bet is referring to the permanent sense.


The best scenario should be to just leave it as pending and see if they play again in 2021. As long as they're willing to revisit the bet in 2021, if a new season begins, then the bettor is no worse off. My concern would be this time next year if they try to claim it's over and done with and refuse to revisit the issue since "it was already graded and settled months ago".

[Kaabee]

Go on Twitter and try to get XFL's opinion on this. They promote gambling so maybe they'll respond.

[Prof Bungletree]

Lawyer here with no vested interest. I agree that the league has not, as of now, ceased operations. It is a really poorly worded prop. They've paused operations, but ceased is final. And we don't know yet.

By the way, I'm fully aware that quoting the dictionary is a douche move. But it matters here. Cease means "bring or come to an end." The league has not, as of 3/24, come to an end. The season has, but the league has not.